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Gays Are Not Evil & Atheists Are Not Immoral
Case in point: Debater Innomen. And I (used to be Atheist). One has only to read Innomen's posts to see he is not evil. When I was an Atheist I was a virgin, and never did any drugs, alcohol, never smoked anything, never ran around or got into any kind of legal trouble or moral trouble. My morals were better than nearly any Christian. There seems to be misunderstanding and misconceptions about what people are like, what they are all about. Are we to judge anyone at all? Are we not often incorrect in assumptions? God is love.
 Scorpion  26 Aug 2008 09:02
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From what I have seen people who are atheist or gay have a far higher moral standards than most Christians. They are more accepting, understanding and do not have their morals dictated to them through that of a book.
 
 kddan  27 Aug 2008 14:34
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I have Gay friends who are not evil, and one of my best friends is an Atheist. May I add that he is one of the kindest, most thoughtful people on this planet. In fact I haven't met a Christian yet, with a higher standard of kind morals. Keep the Faith!
 
 joe9  27 Aug 2008 14:29
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 Thank you, Joe9, for your love, and for your kindness, and compassionate wisdom.
You are one of a kind: my kind.;-)

Also, my brother is gay - always was. He was my best good friend while we were kids.
We were too young to have ever herd of gay and certainly did not know what it was.
He told me when he was 18 or 19, that he had never had a feeling of any attraction for a female - ever.

I never understood that, but I still loved and supported him as my dear brother, while the rest of the so-called-"Family" was busy DISOWNING HIM......my brother attempted suicide several times: he was a Christian, always, to the best of my knowledge, always, loved God......
We used to sing together at weddings, people begged us to do duets becasue that gay brother and I did exceptional vocals like the carpenters.

One of our older brothers hurt and rejected my gay brother so bad, he tried to kill himself, like the internet debater in here "Innomen".....when I read Innomen's post he was debating with Stranger, that one? well, it brought back all that Misery with my so-called-"Family" years ago......and my gay brother....all that total-Cr@p............as well as my own traumatic-sexual-history.......not gay, no, but still painful.

And you know what?

All that I have seen and learned has only made me Compasssionate for others.
That is what Life is for.

XOXOXOXO to you, Joe9.

Sincerely,
Eden.
("Scorpion")

God Bless You for all your Sweetness to me. Thank you SO MUCH.
by  Scorpion
 28 Aug 2008 01:50
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Yes indeed. And you have an interesting past Scorpion, and I mean that as a compliment.

I was raised very Catholic but now am much more open minded. I've never been an atheist but I also don't think any of the church dogmas are necessary for an individual to win God's grace. And I've known people from many different world religions, as well as atheists, who were living their lives equal or better than most Christian's I knew.

I also went through a phase when younger trying for abstinence and waiting for marriage, but in college I took that next inevitable step and have had no regrets since. I don't think I was a better person then, nor a better person now (but I do feel more mature and balanced after getting over being uptight about abstinence), and frankly I don't think anymore that nonmarital sex reflects badly on a person's morals. As long as they're responsible about it. Nor do I have any issues with homosexuality, what other people choose to do for sex is their own business so long as it's not illegal.
 
 Grenache  26 Aug 2008 13:45
 1 Comment
 
 thank you Grenache.
I appreciate the compliment, as I know you do not just say things or throw compliments away like some do.
Coming from you, it IS a compliment. Thank you. :-)


I have never been a lesbian myself, but I do not treat people like CR@P just because they have an issue I do not have.
I would only have a problem with a lesbian hitting on me, and they HAVE done that ! I did not like it at all.
As long as others keep their sex-urges about me to themselves, I will be very civil. Very civil. And understanding too. Even kind. :-)

Actually? I do not appreciate it when men give me unwelcome passes either, so it is not like I am inconsistent.
I think that people should subtly find out if a woman is open to them or attracted mutually first, before she OR he makes overt sexual advances towards a woman......I am very uncomfortable with UNWELCOME SEXUAL ADVANCES, and it makes me very unhappy to have to be mean in order to cool someone off towards me......
I just think that all people should test the waters very subtly first, before making passes on anyone. Overt harrassment is very uncomfortable. I don't like to hurt people. Not at all.
I have been raped several times by different men in my past, when I was young, and I am very sensitive to people's sexual feelings and wishes and actions towards me, but also to others: I a would never stand by while anyone was raped or harrassed: I would KICK THEIR ASS ! I would always help someone out who was being raped or molested or ganged up on sexually: I would take charge of that situation no matter what the personal cost to me.
To do LESS would be Wrong, Immoral, and Lacking In Moral-Fiber and Character.

Sorry about this long-winded post......Grenache.
None of this has anything at all to do with your post.
I just opened some old wounds of my own, last night when I was reading the debate in here in this site between Stranger and Innomen: it made me FEEL so much impathy and compassion towards Innomen, even though I have never been a lesbian myself, and Innomen is a gay man, not a gay women, still, it was the exchange between Stranger (who did a good job by the way), and the conversation between them........just opened up my heart all the way, to the pain Innomen was feelings.....I could relate to his Pain, not his specific life-experience-sexually, but just the pain, yes. very much so.
A woman who has been raped and molested, it appears, experiences the same Pain as a gay man rejected by the Church and Society: oh, this is so wrong !!! How could I NOT feel his Pain too?
I did.
That post brought tears to my eyes several times, whiles reading it last night.

The fact is, whatever our sexual challenges as individual human beings, it is all Pain, and that is what makes us the same.

Innomen is not evil. Innomen IS gay.
Innomen IS a Christian, I could tell, reading his post, it comes across so clearly, his heart is to love God.....I feel only.....Compassion.
To feel less,, after reading Innomen's post with Stranger, would mean I myself was less than Human. And I AM Human: very.

Anyway, that was what opened up my own wounds, and WHY I wrote this long-winded post, for which I apologize if I have unduly burdened you by too much information.

Anyway, Grenache, I thank you again for the kind compliment.
I really appreciate it.

Most Sincerely,
Eden.("Scorpion").
xoxoxoxoxo 2 u. (^ - ^)
by  Scorpion
 26 Aug 2008 19:57
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If there was any sin. Let him who is without sin cast the first stone.
 
 keepmindok  26 Aug 2008 10:43
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 I was a VIRGIN Atheist, and impeccable moral-values, which I DID live up to: the actions on the outside of my life did not change while I was busy being an atheist, only the questions and prayers of my heart changed. I was THE SAME PERSON.
Just had not found my way to my Creator then yet is all.
I was 15/16 years old back then: was 25 years ago now.

I do not think that very many people pass accurate judgements on the people they ASSUME THINGS about.
That is why I myself am so misunderstood by the people in the town I live in, and I was just reading debater Innomen's post with Stranger.....I found a great deal to open my eyes about in that debate they were carrying on.
I just think that if someone is at all compassionate or a shred of Humanity left within them, they WOULD FEEL COMPASSIONATE towards a gay man like the caliber of person he is, it is important to know someone's story, you know what I mean Keepmindok?

I have never been plagued with lesbianism myself, I am far too infatuated with men in general to have that as a problem myself, I do however feel deep Impathy and Compassion for those who are the downtrodden by Society and Misunderstood or the Persecuted, whatever their challenge or issue is.
I always root for the underdog, if that said person is humble and sweet. An angry mean person would not garner my sympathy though, because that is an attitude that repels my feelings of compassion, like, they do not need my help, so I guess an aggressive, hostile gay would be on his own: obviously could handle their own challenges.

I think that Christ would root for the downtrodden.
The sad.
The grief-filled ones, don't you, Keepmindok?

I just think that as Christians, it is our job to be AS Christ to those who are the most exploited and need love and acceptance the most.
That's my story, and I am sticking to it. :-)

XOXOXOXOXOXO

Sincerely,
Eden:
"Scorpion":
Defender of the Needy and Downtrodden(I have a stinger with which to defend these who are in need of my assistance....;-)

Keepmindok, if you ever get picked on in here, I will take your part: you are a loving and warm and caring heart, GOD BLESS YOU, my friend.
by  Scorpion
 26 Aug 2008 19:35
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I agree, this is only common sense. You can't base a few decisions made by one to judge him or her overall.
 
 verum  26 Aug 2008 10:36
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 I agree, verum.
by  Scorpion
 26 Aug 2008 20:55
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I’m inclined to agree.
 
 Hizashi  26 Aug 2008 09:57
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Who cares?

Not to be calloused about the "issue" but I think the fact that it is an issue only proves that evil and immorallity exist on both sides of it.

People, right or wrong, are going to have opinions about it, and those opinions are as acceptable as the behavior/beliefs.

In the grand scheme of things I tend to agree with the above statement, but defend a society's right not to. If, as a whole, a society finds these things unacceptable, so be it. I don't care.

I don't think it's any big secret that I'm a conservative. I applaud any gay/atheist who has the same political views I do. If that person were to run for office, that would be great too. However if that person was running against a straight christian - and all views we're equal, the straight christian gets my vote.

That's all for now.
 
 Cons_Lies  26 Aug 2008 21:09
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 LOL I am a straight Christian too,............
by  Scorpion
 27 Aug 2008 00:14
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